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Author Topic: Need QU Sharpening Help with my new Epson 3000  (Read 5689 times)
MelW
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« on: March 06, 2012, 01:51:33 AM »

So, after many thousands of prints, my Epson 2200 gave out last fall.  Have had the Epson 3000 now for about 3 months and there is a lot about it that I love.  I could write a long list of the good, the bad and the ugly of it if anyone cares, but right now, I need a little advice.  What I have noticed is that with my QU settings that I have been using, the prints from the new printer are generally over sharpened.  What I want to do is experiment now, and would just like a little advice maybe on some starting points.  For some reason, the problem seems worse with jpegs than for raw, where I am more likely to let the auto settings go unaltered.

Mel - Columbia, Md.
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Fred A
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« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2012, 10:11:10 AM »

Quote
What I have noticed is that with my QU settings that I have been using, the prints from the new printer are generally over sharpened.  What I want to do is experiment now, and would just like a little advice maybe on some starting points.  For some reason, the problem seems worse with jpegs than for raw, where I am more likely to let the auto settings go unaltered.

Mel - Columbia, Md.

Hi Mel,
I'll try to help....
Let's start with JPGS
We first check the camera for a built in sharpening to the JPGs. Usually that can be tamed or turned off.
Next we ask you what if anything you are using in the Unsharp Mask screen of the Editor.
I assume that you are not adding any sharpening in there yet or you wouldn't be asking...

Let's look at RAW.
In the Qimage Ultimate, EDIT, Preferences, RAW OPTIONS, there's a default setting for basic sharpening because Raw images start off soft,
I think it's a 2/150 with EQ slider to the right.
This affects only RAW.

Now let's look at the item that can affect both types of prints, and look OK on the screen, yet print too sharp.

This would be SMART SHARPEN. See screen snap

The default is 5. I have never heard of a "5" over sharpening, but check that number, and reduce it.

The Smart sharpen generally is altered only when the paper print is too sharp or too soft for the type of paper and the printer. Once you find your happy spot, you leave it.

OK Mel, A place to start.

Fred

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MelW
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« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2012, 11:03:15 PM »

Thanks Fred - I think I am OK on all of those - those settings the same as I used on the 2200 - and I can't see why the results would not be the same.  So now I am fooling with the USM settings.
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Fred A
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« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2012, 11:38:43 PM »

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those settings the same as I used on the 2200 - and I can't see why the results would not be the same.

Never mind the 2200 settings. The whole point of Smart Sharpen is that different printers and papers might need different settings.
Try a print with the default 5 for Smart Sharpen.

The 2200 was essentially a matte paper printer. It never got along with glossy paper too well. You might have used a high Smart Sharpen setting, too high for the 3000.
Just guessing!
Fred
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MelW
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« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2012, 02:40:42 AM »

Fred -

Well you zoned in right on the issue - it is matte printing.  I almost never printed glossy or luster with the 2200 for reasons you state - just did not like the results.  Even with the 3000, I don't like the real glossy papers, but love the results I get on Luster or any of the F type gloss papers. 

Anyway, for the matte papers - and my normal paper is the Moab Entrada double sided - I always printed with the default smart sharpening at 5 - and have let that setting alone with the 3000.  Maybe I shhould try cranking it down to 4 or 3?  I got some improvement by reducing my normal USM settings which were mild anyway.

I also think what I need to do next is a side by side of the same print, with same settings.  This may not be that easy since I can no longer print on the 2200, and I can't be absolutely sure what settings were used in some of the prints I have - but I think I may have enough "controlled examples" - after I do that - probably over this weekend - I'll see what other suggestions you may have.

Thanks Again
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Fred A
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« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2012, 10:33:27 AM »

Quote
This may not be that easy since I can no longer print on the 2200, and I can't be absolutely sure what settings were used in some of the prints I have - but I think I may have enough "controlled examples" - after I do that - probably over this weekend - I'll see what other suggestions you may have.

It just sounds strange that a person suffers from over sharpening and has nothing turned on too much.
Must be something we overlooked.
I don't know how much help this might be, but if you open the print log from the FILE menu, and find a 2200 print, it wont tell you the numerical setting of Smart Sharpen, but it will tell you whether it was on or off.
Maybe it was OFF when you were using the 2200?

What are your actual numbers in the EDIT PREFERENCES RAW OPTIONS USM box?
One thought crossed my mind.... look at the sample box attached.
Maybe you have the Equalizer slider to the left instead of the right?
This would only affect RAW, and since you say you are oversharpened in both JPG and RAW, I have to go back to Smart Sharpen...
Since you are only saying the prints look over sharpened (the screen is OK), again points the Flying Fickle Finger of Fate at Smart Sharpen set too high.
Try turning Smart Sharpen off.
Jeez Louise! Now I have to wait for Saturday or Sunday to solve this.?
Mel, take a few vacation days off.  Wink Wink Wink

Fred
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MelW
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« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2012, 01:49:48 AM »

OK Fred - I finally got back to this issue.  Smart sharpen is not the problem.  The short answer appears to be - Mel is an idiot.  The longer answer is I realized I really was not having a problem with raw, only with some jpegs.  Appears to go back to some saved USM settings that I have been using forever on jpegs only - specifically, settings that go back to when the slider was there only as a sharpness equalizer (I use it now mainly on portraits to sharpen everything except skin tone) and even before there was a slider.  I'm still not sure how these translate into what's happening.  What I do know is that if I forget about reusing settings from 3 or 4 years ago, and take any picture through an appropriate workflow, I can get the result I want.  I also need to get used to this printer.  My sense is that on matter papers, the 3000 may be very slightly inferior to the 2200.  But now for the first time in years, I am creating luster and type F glossy prints that are super. I'll update once I have run a few more comparisons; thanks much for the help; your mention of the slider was the tip-off I needed.
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Fred A
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« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2012, 09:26:59 AM »

Mel,
I said something that helped?HuhHuhHuhHuhHuhHuh
Circle the calendar day!

Glad you found it.

Fred
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