Mike Chaney's Tech Corner

The Associative Filter file is saved in the C:\ProgramData\ddisoftware\Qimage\Plugins\Export\ folders instead of the location of where my photo is coming from.
Am I doing something wrong here? Is there a setting that I could use to get the behavior that is documented in the Enhancement/Filter Application panel?

The associative filter (.flt) gets saved in the same folder / location where the image is located.
So if you created some adjustments using Image Edit, that filter will be with the image. When you move it or copy it with Qimage, the filter moves too.
Fred

I agree Fred, that is how it should work, which is also my desirable behavior, but as I mentioned in my post, it is not saving the file in the location the photo file is coming from, but in one of the Export-created folders.

I think we need Mike

Are you using the LR/PS plug-in?  If so, PS and LR don't send the location of the original file: the files are exported to that Export folder.  So in essence, if you work on images after exporting them using the plug-ins, the filters are being saved in the location with the images: which is the export folder.

Regards,
Mike

Hi Mike,

I'm an Affinity user, which does not support Qimage. I'm opening the files from iMatch. However, this is happening even if I open the original directly from the system.

Hi Mike,

Do you have any suggestions on how to fix the issue I have?

No.  The issue appears to be unique to your system.  No one else has ever reported a similar problem and it is not possible to replicate.  Unless there is some additional info beyond what has been discussed, it appears to be a problem outside the operation of Qimage.

Regards,
Mike

Oh Mike... You answer gave me pause, as I assume that you are very experienced software developer. You know that "it works on my system" is not a good answer when a customer reports an issue, right?

So, is that a matter of bandwidth for you time? If yes, than what is the complain-threshold for you would actually look into an issue?
Are there any logs that can be enabled and collected so you can identify where the problem is coming from?

Again, I was very surprised and disappointed by your answer...

Sir, I rarely inject comments when unsolicited, but you are too rude for me to let this pass.
If you had any experience with software, you would know that an issue must be able to be repeated to be diagnosed.

I know Mike for over 20 years. He has never shirked any responsibility even if there was only an inkling of possibility that his software was at fault.
He gave you a logical and sensible reply. With thousands of Qimage versions running on various operating systems, and not one complaint like yours, plus Mike's long running writing code to run in Windows, he has concluded that your issue appears to be unique.
He also left the door open for you. He offered an open door in case you came up with more info.
You really should be drafting an apology for  Mile.

I will not reply to this thread if you decide to post.
Fred

My answer gave you pause, why?  Because I was direct in my answer?  Or because my answer wasn't what you wanted it to be?

You asked if I had any further suggestions on how to fix the issue and I simply answered that given the information I have, the answer is no; I have no further suggestions.  It's not like I'm saying "It works on my system"... I'm saying it works on every single one of the tens of thousands of copies of Qimage ever sold, and you are the only one who has ever reported a problem with a filter file not being saved in the same folder as the image file.  It's kind of like buying a popular vehicle like a Ford F-150 and then going to an F-150 forum and saying "I can only fill my tank on Tuesday after the sun sets: any suggestions on how to fix?".  When you get replies like "???????" or strange looks, you know you might need to provide a little more info.

So if/until I get additional info about the problem, I have no suggestions on how to fix something that cannot even be defined.  Now, if you do provide more info, we may be able to figure out what is going on.  For example, you must be going through some process/workflow to determine that you edited an image in a certain folder but it's filter file ends up on the export folder.  What were your steps and how did you come to the conclusion the filter file ended up in the wrong folder?  Also, if the filter file ended up in the export folder but the image itself is in a different folder, the edits won't work: you can bring that image up and the edits you made won't show.  Did you try that?  And so on... anything you can think of with respect to what you know about the problem would be helpful since you are the only one having that problem.

Mike

Fred, I'm blunt, direct, and I'm not impolite. I am sure that Mike is better than that, and his helping answers among the thread is a testimony of that, and that is why his answer gave me big time pause.

You are too biased as you know Mike for 20 years.

I just bought the product, and as any customer I expect what is standard from support standpoint.


I'm not expecting any answer form you Fred, going forward, and actually, based on the message you sent please don't.
 
However, I'm expecting DDISoftware, Mike, to stand by Qimage; if not, I'll be OK with a refund.



 

I noticed that, which is why I gave you a direct answer as I thought you'd appreciate that.  The answer was that I cannot suggest a "fix" based on the info you supplied so far as I don't even know that a fix is needed.  The only information I have is a statement that you believe filter files are not where they belong when you send images from IMatch or "the system" (not sure what "the system" is in this context).  If you want to elaborate on what functions you are using in Qimage that lead you to the conclusion that the filter files should be in a folder other than where you find them, I might be able to go further.


I'm here, standing by it.  Again, I don't want to try to pick every possible guess as to why you might have made a comment like the filter files not being in the right place.  You've owned Qimage for 3 months now (since October).  Have you noted the same behavior that entire time and did you notice the same behavior in the trial that I'm sure you tried before purchasing?  Did you watch the "Getting Started" video (red "v" button on the main UI window) that shows how to properly bring up original files/images when running Qimage in stand-alone mode?

Again, all I have from you so far is a statement that you think associative filter files shouldn't be in an "Export" subfolder.  I don't know what functions you are using, how you got there, or what you are seeing to make you think that.  For example, if you are IN an Export subfolder and you edit an image in there, the filters should be in that Export folder because those are copies of images (hence the name "Export").  To get to your originals, you should use the folder browser directly above the thumbnails and go to the folder(s) where those originals reside.  I don't know if that's the problem or not, just one guess of many.  So unless you elaborate on what is going on, there's nothing I can do.

Mike

Hi Mike,

This is a test that depicts my issue.

• I've create a simple folder on my C: drive, C:\Qimage test and placed there a jpg file, Hope.jpg
• I opened the Hope.jpg file from the Qimage test folder with Qimage.
• In Qimage I've altered the Exposure for this file, then I invoked Done
• Qimage presented me with the Enhancement/Filter Application dialog that's clearly stating that the FLT associative file would be saved where the original file was opened from (see the EnhancementFilter Application_2.png file attached to this message); so, I'm expecting that the associative FLT file would be created in the C:\Qimage test directory.

Qimage saves the Hope.jpg and the FLT file in C:\ProgramData\ddisoftware\Qimage\Plugins\Export\2020-01-16 11.22.36 [Files]. I don't disagree in any way that that Qimage should use this "Export" folder, but that is not the expected behavior that is documented, and desired by me, in the Enhancement/Filter Application dialog.

I hope that this makes it more clear.

Thanks for outlining your example.  I have a guess as to where the confusion lies so please allow me to clarify what operations you are using since editing Hope.jpg in the Qimage test folder should never involve an Export folder.  The proper steps for editing Hope.jpg in the Qimage test folder are:

• Click on the "Folders" panel above the thumbnails and navigate to C:\Qimage test
• You are now working in C:\Qimage test: to edit Hope.jpg from that folder, you can double click it's thumbnail to open the editor
• Make your edits, click done, and "Associate" as you did before

Note that the proper method of opening your original files when using Qimage in stand-alone mode is illustrated at 1:45 in the Getting Started video.  Watch a few seconds from this point as it shows you how to properly go to the C:\Qimage test folder using the folder browser above the thumbnails: https://youtu.be/-jUd5LpJNBM?t=105

Rather than browsing to C:\Qimage test using the folder bar above the thumbnails (so that you are actually working in C:\Qimage test), it sounds like you are using "File", "Open File(s)..." which is an export command that opens copies of the files in an Export folder so that you don't alter the originals.  If you use this method, you'll know you aren't altering the originals because you'll see that your current working folder is C:\ProgramData\ddisoftware\Qimage\Plugins\Export\2020-01-16 11.22.36 [Files].  So if you open the copy of Hope.jpg from that folder, the filter will be saved in that folder (same folder as the copy of Hope.jpg you edited).

Hope this helps.  Long story short, the answer is, if you want to place filters on your original images, browse to the location of your original images in the thumbnails rather than using the "File", "Open File(s)..." command which is designed to open a select few files from an existing folder in a temporary location.

Mike

Hi Mike,

Every software is built upon relevant use cases. I totally agree that the current Qimage implementation satisfies real needs of many people that are your, probably, "targeted market segment", people that are organizing event albums, professional photographers, or people that are selling their work through print labs.


However, I also suggest that Qimage should/could be targeted to amateur photographers, which I am one of.
Many of these photo amateurs are organizing their photos using folders, or a wide range of pseudo-DAMs (e.g. XnView, FastStone, Luminar, Lightroom, just to name a few) or real DAMs (such as iMatch, Photo Supreme). One common thing about these all these tools is that they are allowing "open with" from within their own environment for one or more photos that are selected.

Personally, I'm using iMatch, XnView, FastStone, and even the regular OS browser to open images for a given purpose, including for printing.

Qimage allows currently opening a file using "open with". If this is an unintended scenario for Qimage, a defect, I suggest that you disable it; but if you are doing this, I assume that you would leave money on the table this way, as many people would not consider buying the product, or your customers that already have the product would be simply outraged. However, if you keep it in, I think that you should take care of it from end-to-end, including being truthful to the message from the Enhancement/Filter Application panel of saving the associative file where the file was opened in the given session.

The same goes for Qimage sessions that are being created by doing a drag-and-drop from a external tool or OS browser!

As a (suggested) solution, when someone opens a file using "open with" or through drag-and-drop in Qimage, Qimage should open a temporary "one file album", like is being done today, shift the "Folders (click to open/close)" to the newly generated ...\Plugins\Export\... folder, and mark the given Qimage session that it should save the associative files to the real location where the file came into Qimage working session. That would include all the files that might be added to the given sessions from all kinds of unrelated folders through drag-and-drop.

I don't think that this should be too difficult to achieve...

I also think that in the situation when the file is open in Qimage using "open with" or through drag-and-drop, the "Output folder" for "Create New Images" in the Enhancement/Filter Application panel should also be set to the folder where the file was originated from.

It's really not that difficult (or complicated).  The location of the image(s) you are opening is shown immediately above the thumbnails.  If you are in an "Export" subfolder, the location of the images is the Export subfolder: if you open an image from there, you are opening an image from that Export subfolder.  Therefore, the associative filter message is always correct since it stores the flt file in the same location as the image you just opened (the Export subfolder).

Now when sending images from other programs, there are other considerations.  If you open a File Explorer window or other similar file-browsing software, select some images, and right click "Send To, Qimage Ultimate", QU will use those images from their original folder without using an "Export" folder because it knows you sent them from a file manager type program.  But, if you use something that deals with opening files (rather than just browsing), Qimage cannot access the files from their original location because they are likely open in another program: this is why it must create Export subfolders!

Consider an example of having 5 images open in Photoshop: test1.jpg through test5.jpg in a folder C:\photos.  When you use the Photoshop plugin to send images to Qimage, Qimage cannot open test1.jpg through test5.jpg in their original C:\photos folder because: (a) Photoshop already has those images open and you'd get an access denied error and (b) you may not have saved the images after editing them so even if you could open them, they wouldn't have the edits you just made in Photoshop (the edited images you have open in PS may not exist in any folder yet).

So just familiarize yourself with the scenarios where you are exporting vs opening in Qimage and everything will make sense.

Regards,
Mike

I think that somehow, I failed to get across my message.

I'm not using the Qimage "export" folders at all. In my workflow approach, I don't want to go to this folder. These don't exist for me, and based on my workflow, I should never have any use for them. Actually, I think that the "export" folders should be more of behind the scene of Qimage, and not exposed to end users, but I might be wrong as I don't know where these requirements came to you from.

The image attached shows that if I'm opening a file from a given location, using "open with" or through drag-and-drop, the source folder is not showing up above the thumbnails.

True, this might happen when the print is invoked from Photoshop, and I understand your reason for creating a copy behind the scene, but not everybody is working out of Photoshop, as I already made the point in the previous message that I've posted. I'm sending the file to Qimage from sources that are not locking the file for editing.

I'm repeating again, for me the original file location is still not the "Export" folder; the associative file should be saved in the original file location, so when I am opening it again, I should not have to crawl through the cryptic (cryptic because under the Export folder is just a bunch a date/time folder names) in order to find its associative file.

No Mike... I don't want to familiarize myself with "Export" folder-thing... Again, from my standpoint, it should not be even be exposed to the end user...

Then we are indeed talking about two different things!  Qimage will not create an Export folder when using "Send To" from another application... unless you ask it to:

Open QU and select "Edit", "Preferences", "When Images are Dropped into Qimage Ultimate" and select "View in Thumbnails" or "Add to Queue".  If this option is set to "Create Copies in New Export Folder", then... that's what it'll do.  You probably want one of the other options:

- Add to Queue: the sent images will appear in the live view as prints (at whatever the current print size is).
- View in Thumbnails: the sent images will appear (in their original location) in the thumbnails.

Note that if you typically open/send multiple images from multiple/different folders, you would use "Add to Queue" since only the queue (live view) can hold images from more than one folder and the thumbnails can only show one folder at a time.

Mike

Mike!!! Excellent!!!  :) We are almost there.

Now I get what I need, but with one exception. In the case that I want to take advantage of the excellent upscaling capabilities of Qimage, the Fusion interpolation algorithm, and save a TIFF file, then in the Enhancement/Filter Application panel, the Output folder for the Create new image option should be set to the location where the original file was opened from.
Right now the Output folder is retaining the last location I've manually set in the last session when this option was used. Is there a setting to resolve this one as well?

As long as I'm interpretting the question correctly, yes, that can be done: select all text in the "Output Folder" field and delete it to make that field empty.  If it's empty, copies are saved in the same folder(s) as the original(s).

Mike

That's it, Mike!
We can consider this issue as closed.

Thank you very much for your help!

You're welcome.  Glad we were able to stick with it and find a solution.

Regards,
Mike