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Author Topic: Experiences  (Read 25681 times)
ericd
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« on: June 02, 2009, 07:39:14 AM »

Fellow Photgraphers,

I have recently been photographing some indoor Gymnastic competitions here in Melbourne, and thought I might comment on one of my experiences.
With gymnastics as you can well imagine you have fast moving subjects in dimly lit (photography wise) stadiums/halls.
Inevitably you have dark coloured matting along with backlight and multi coloured walls!!!! Sheesh!
The gymnasts are usually wearing multi coloured outfits and all in all its a tough trot.

I use 2 cameras for this a 5d and a 1ds Mark3 (yep! Canon guy!) I find the 5d a bit slow in the dim surroundings but when it focuses, it is superb!
On the other hand the 1d is super fast, and extremely accurate in its metering, and this is where the problem lies!!!!!

I usually shoot with the 70 - 200 2.8 IS lens and the the 1.4 extender and have spot metering as my default. This gives me an extremely small metering area.
I wondered for some time why 2 shots of the same gymnast shot in rapid succession lets say on a bar, were so differently exposed!!!!

I worked out that whilst following the gymnasts movement I was not as good as I thought at keeping the subject in the relative center of the frame.
As a result the camera would be metering for backgrounds, gymnasts attire, floor mats, ceilings and ocassionaly the gymnasts face which is what I try to track to!
It took a few meets for me to cotton onto just how accurate this camera is in that area, and just how much the exposure can change when your not metering for the entire seen.

I haven't been able to come up with a better way as yet, and I doubt there is one considering the limitations when photographing this sport.
As a result, my expectations with respect to keepers has dropped accordingly, and I do not have a misbehaving D1 as I first thought!

Just a rant, but something I thought I might share with a view to stimulating conversation..

Regards
Eric D.  Grin ;


 
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Terry-M
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« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2009, 11:50:29 AM »

Hi Eric,
Melbs is a great city, I was there for a few days last October.
The only (limited) experience I've had in a similar situation was taking some on-stage shots of dancing & singing, individuals and groups. The lighting was constant so I found that it was best to use a fixed manual setting, with regular checks on the histogram.
Worth a try?
Terry.
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rpcohen
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« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2009, 01:59:52 AM »

Hi Eric,

I agree with Terry's suggestion about using a fixed exposure instead.  Also, if you're not already doing so, shooting in RAW can give you more latitude for adjusting over or under exposures so the exact metering is not as critical.

Ralph
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ericd
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« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2009, 08:16:08 AM »

Folks,

Ralph & Terry, thanks for your suggestions.
Raw is all I ever shoot ... mostly a benefit, sometimes a pain.
Post processing all those raw files takes time, no matter what program you use!
With respect to manual settings, due to the varying amounts of light particularly with the routines that revolve around movement such as floor, vault and to a lesser degree the other's shooting manual is in my opinion more of a risk.
With the speed at which the gymnast performs their routines, endeavouring to stop motion in poor lighting is paramount, so always have high ISO and very large aperture. (I know, by a D3 Nikon!!!)
Even then speeds are down around 125 - 250 max. At these speeds it is difficult to stop the fast moving extremities.

Good to hear from you guy's by the way.

Regards
Eric D.   
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Fred A
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« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2009, 10:43:28 AM »

Hi Eric et al.
I don't have such a dramatic or or auspicious story to tell, (Experiences), but I like the topic and I think we all have some odd things happen.
I was going to write yesterday, and include the image, but I haven't figured out how to insert an image in my post.

Regardless, here's my strange tale.
I was sort of walking around in an area in SW Florida, near Venice, called the jette by most locals.
Not much to shoot... some boats, some fishermen, and then I spotted this tree with about a dozen black birds perched in various places in the tree.
Not a great shot, but what the heck. I put my Canon 20D up to my eye and as I depressed the shot button, a good sized white gull flew into the viewfinder, and I had a great shot!
Moral of the story I guess would be keep shooting! It's digital, reusable memory cards, and have a lot of fun.
Worst of it all: I have been accused of "inserting" that gull into the shot.
:-)   Fred
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Terry-M
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« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2009, 01:12:01 PM »

Fred,
If you haven't got a web site or photo gallery, just attach a downsized image (<128KB) using Additional Options, bottom left of the screen.
Terry.
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admin
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« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2009, 01:39:24 PM »

Worst of it all: I have been accused of "inserting" that gull into the shot.
:-)   Fred

Only the people who don't really know you.  I know you don't know how to use PhotoShop.  Wink

Mike
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Fred A
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« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2009, 09:53:13 AM »

Nor would I buy Photo Shop !!!
But if a certain magnificent programmer of Qimage were to suddenly find a way to put a "clone" tool into Qimage Studio, most of the people that I know that do buy Photo Shop, would not any more, and have the money to buy Studio. Cheesy Wink
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admin
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« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2009, 12:20:33 PM »

Nor would I buy Photo Shop !!!
But if a certain magnificent programmer of Qimage were to suddenly find a way to put a "clone" tool into Qimage Studio, most of the people that I know that do buy Photo Shop, would not any more, and have the money to buy Studio. Cheesy Wink

The only thing you should be removing from photos are blemishes and other small spots.  Qimage encourages you to shoot proper photos and it bolsters communication between photographer and subject(s): if you don't want Uncle Egbert in the photo, ask him to step aside when you are taking the shot.  That way you won't have to clone his ugly butt out of the photo later.

 Grin

Mike
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Fred A
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« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2009, 11:25:40 AM »

OOH, I just noticed that clicking on the small image attachment brings up a larger one. I can see my black birds in the tree as well as the gull.
Hmm this forum thing might become pretty good?
Now if I can only get the owner/moderator off my back!  Tongue Roll Eyes Grin
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Terry-M
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« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2009, 11:40:09 AM »

Quote
Now if I can only get the owner/moderator off my back!
Clone him off in Photoshop.  Grin
Oh, I forgot, you don't know how to!
Terry.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2009, 11:48:43 AM by Terry-M » Logged
Fred A
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« Reply #11 on: June 05, 2009, 11:49:48 AM »

Clone him off in Photoshop.  Grin

Maybe I can use Liquify.  Then when the sun comes out in Fl., well evaporation???
 Cheesy
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admin
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« Reply #12 on: June 05, 2009, 01:33:39 PM »

Bet I can drop the ban hammer quicker than you can clone me out!  Wanna race?   Grin  Now if you used the blemish tool in Qimage, that might be a closer race.   Roll Eyes

Mike
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Seth
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« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2009, 05:33:30 PM »

I haven't been able to come up with a better way as yet, and I doubt there is one considering the limitations when photographing this sport.
As a result, my expectations with respect to keepers has dropped accordingly, and I do not have a misbehaving D1 as I first thought!
 

I have shot a lot of indoor track.  Between Nikon ad Canon there is NOT much difference in the pro gear, so here goes.

First off, I carry a digital light meter (cough, cough).  Yes, hand held metering in many cases is better than the in camera.  Nowadays the big two (and more) are messing with dominant colors in the metering, etc. that throws us off.  I don't use it all the time, but for the wider stuff (12-24 and 17-55/2.Cool it works.  With the 70-200/2.8 or 300 /2.8 the camera metering is pretty tight with center weight.

The other thing is to use center weighted or spot metering.  Some of the boxes let you move the metering point too.  Also, adjust the size of the center weight metering area in the custom settings.

One other trick (but play with it first!) is a Dave Black trick.  I am not sure if Canon will let you do this.  He does this in outdoor stadiums for football games where part of the field is in shade.  (It doesn't matter whose football; US, Fiji, England.  Grin Grin)  Set the camera to shutter priority.  Also set it to Auto ISO.   Set the ISO range--outdoors from 200 low and 640 or 800 high; indoor track I'd set to 800 and 1600, depending on the camera.   Most running events can be nailed from 1/60th to 1/250th.   High jump, long jump, pole vault, etc. head-on can work at 1/125.   

Effectively, the shutter speed stays the same--only the f/stop and /or ISO change.   In full manual only the ISO moves.

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Seth
<CWO4 (FMF) USN, Ret.>
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