Mike Chaney's Tech Corner

Are there camera specific profiles for pre-processing raw files?
I lookes,under edit preferences and get a template but the custom button
Points to an empty directory.
How does this work?
I just acquired a Canon t2i and have a bunch of raw images.

That directory is where your raw setting preferences are saved: sharpening, noise reduction etc. Start off with the default settings and see how you get on. I leave smart colour un-ticked. Make sure "Enable Custom Profiles" is ticked because one is available for your camera. NB. the T2i is also known as a EOS 550D. When you hover your mouse over a thumb, the exif hot bar at the bottom of the screen will show the profile associated with the image and you should see EOS 550D.icm. It's not embedded in the raw image; embedded profiles such as for jpeg's and tif will show * .... * indicating it's embedded.
Terry

Fred did a "challenge" and video on this very subject!
See here, video link is on the post -
http://ddisoftware.com/tech/qimage-ultimate-challenges/challenge-80-the-mystery-of-the-qsn-file/msg21199/#msg21199 (http://ddisoftware.com/tech/qimage-ultimate-challenges/challenge-80-the-mystery-of-the-qsn-file/msg21199/#msg21199)
Terry

i dont get that data on the screen bottom.

I looked directly into the profile directory and there are lotsa .icm files but non
t for either REBEL T2i or 550D.

I made a change to the settings and saved it as EOS REBEL T2i. This made
a qsn file. But when i reloaded it the settings did not change.

I dont quite get it.

Also whats the difference between .icm and .qsm files?

Are you using full screen? Is your mouse over a thumbnail? See attached screen shot.
Try doing this with a thumb selected so QU "knows" what camera was used from the exif data.
.qsn is a custom file extension for QU and it's used for the saved raw preferences.
ICM (Image color management) and ICC extensions are for colour profiles made to the International Color Consortium standards. They define the colour space of an image, camera, printer etc. "Color management" is a process where the color characteristics for every device in the imaging chain is known precisely and utilized in color reproduction"
This may be helpful for CM understanding http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/color-management1.htm (http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/color-management1.htm)
QU is a colour management aware program.

Terry

Two more points to note.
The exif hot bar needs be on in Edit preferences, 2nd from bottom in drop down list.
When you change raw preference, you are asked if you want to re-build thumbs - if there are many, don't bother, just right click on ones you are currently dealing with and select rebuild thumbs.
Terry

PS. Check this Challenge post with the video again:
http://ddisoftware.com/tech/qimage-ultimate-challenges/challenge-80-the-mystery-of-the-qsn-file/ (http://ddisoftware.com/tech/qimage-ultimate-challenges/challenge-80-the-mystery-of-the-qsn-file/)

I am full screen.
Exif bar is enabled
I am over the thumbnail .cr2
Exif says adbobe.icm not EOS 550D
(That file isn't in my install)

 

Hi again,
In Raw preferences, in the Working Color Space section you need to have Enable Custom Profile ticked. The default is Adobe. See attached screenshot.
NB. The 550D and other Canon dslr's have multiple names, T2i is one but I think the exif is always (for US & Europe) the 550D version. Just be aware of that. See second screen shot.
I think I said before, raw files do not have a profile embedded so there'll be no asterisks around the profile name in the exif hot bar.
Terry

NB no files for the eos550d aka t21 aka rebel t2i exist in my installation.

Attached are screenshots of the directory programdata/qimage/profiles

I cover the three alphabetical regions. They are nowhere to be found.
There are over 100 profiles but strangly the 550d is missing.

Your screen shot and qimage website say it should be there. It just isnt.

Is there a download to fix this?

Jim V

Im ready to scream. Is 256K the total for four?
The last try

the other two snaps

Terry must be out so I'll try to help.
Aside from the camera distortion list, there are two lists pertaining to your new camera.
One list that terry showed was to let the user know that your T2i is covered for decoding and Qimage use.
The second list (from Website) shows the cameras for which camera profiles were generated .
Your T2i is not included on that list.
That means that so far no one has taken target shots to create the profile.
There is no stored camera profiles until someone takes the trouble to shoot the targets.

See Terry on specifics. He got a camera about 2 years ago (Canon 600D). I seem to recall Terry creating a profile, but luckily he had his IT-8 target from his Profiler, Profile Prism.

So summarizing, the qsn file where you adjust presets does not need a camera profile so that works fine. Just remember to rebuild the thumbs in question after making changes.
The Adobe colorspace is excellent and you aren't missing a great deal between it and the camera profile.

Fred

I really have no clue anymore.
The camera forces sRGB in simple modes
It can be changed in advanced modes.

When is this distinction actually applied?
  .. In the camera when making jpegs?
 ..When Raw files are processed?

What does qimage do when preprocessing without the profile?
 ..When does it actually use the .qsn file?

My attempts to modify and save the raw prefs did create a .qsn file
but reloading it has zero effect even with a raw thumbnail selected.

 I've watched your video. It has little to do with the mechanical problems Im encountering.

Good questions actually!

That only applies to camera jpeg images not raw images - they are not processed by the camera, hence "raw".
When there is no camera profile, Adobe RGB colour space is used.
When a raw image is loaded into QU it uses the qsn file parameters to process the raw file, noise reduction and sharpening are probably the most significant. Next set smart exposure, auto fill and black point so QU produces the best initial result. Raw refine can then be used to tweak.
You will not see any real changes from the thumbnail. You'd have to look at the image in detail (Image examiner right click on thumb) so see difference, ideally using 2 copies of same image, converted to a good quality jpeg or a tif.
I suggest you leave the noise reduction and sharpening at default but have smart exposure etc. (as above) set.
Have you watched the Learning Videos for raw images? The QU GUI has changes since these were made but the principles are the same.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/JBQPJw-ana8 (https://www.youtube.com/embed/JBQPJw-ana8)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/88jb-__8cmo (https://www.youtube.com/embed/88jb-__8cmo)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/qjkASfTzfFA (https://www.youtube.com/embed/qjkASfTzfFA)
There may be some later videos than these - I'll ask Fred.
Terry

The camera processes JPGS using RGB or Adobe as the color space. It also sharpens and adjusts the image as best it can before placing it on your card.
The Raw image has no color space. It is selected and applied at the time of processing by software.
Qimage supplies a high quality Adobe color space as default.


Qimage defaults to Adobe color space when no specific camera profile is provided.
It uses the QSN file just before it builds the thumb and the cache file.
That is why in order to see any adjustments you made in QSN, you must rebuild the thumbnail that you want to see the change.
You  accomplish this by right click on the thumb (the one you say you do not see a change) and locate the selection REBUILD THUMB of selected image.
You say "EVEN WITH THUMB SELECTED you  do not see any change. "  You must acyually rebuild that thumb, and it will use the QSN file that you set for it.
Did you see the video with the noisy cat?

Hope this helps.
Fred

I'm old and slow.
So let me try this:
1. Modify raw settings as desired.
2. Save under name provided by Qimage (is my camera)
3. Rebuild thumbs to see changes
4. In future Qimage will use the modified .qsn file without manual intervention

BTW when I changed and saved the Raw settings and then reloaded that file by name it did not restore the settinsettings I made. I wasn't looking at the thumbnails, just the Raw parameter window.:

1. Bring up raw prefs
2. Modify one or more items
3. Save under name.qsn
4. Modify some prefs in window
5. Reload saved prefs
6. Saved prefs are not restored-as if edits had no effect.

Am confused once more.

JimV

I am older and slower.
You have it correct.
I have one caveat to offer based on others before you.
These raw pre settings are just that. Pre settings. If you try to adjust the settings to cope with individual images, you will be doing overkill and a disservice to your images.  This a basic setting sothe initial image looks reasoably good. As Terry pointed out the adaptive Noise Reduction and the set once sharpening are all you adjust based on teh lens and the camera sensor's noise.

Yes on future use. That is another point well taken, Jim.  The qsn will be opened and the settings used from it without a ripple. You wont see it open. It will not come to the fore front.  It works in the backgound.
The name of the qsn file is usually taken from the selected thumb' exif. It is not arbitrary. It must be an exact match.
It looks like you are good to go.
Terry might have more to help. But he is in the UK. Must wait for tomorrow.
Fred

Thanks for your trouble.
Eventually I will get it.