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Author Topic: Kelvin and Qimage  (Read 9259 times)
Mack
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« on: March 23, 2013, 08:53:23 PM »

Have some printed image I thought was good enough for framing and bought a picture frame light for it made by Westinghouse with two 15 watt bulbs.

Well, what was a good image is now a very orange image.  Problem is with the T6 15 watt bulbs which are very orange, and get more orange with a dimmer too.  Specs say about 2,450 Kelvin and the Ott viewing light for making (viewing) them is around 5,500K and outside measures 5,200K now on my old Gossen Sixti-Color meter.  Didn't expect them to go that orange (almost like candlelight).

I assume I need to add more blue to the print, or subtract orange somehow.  Maybe even desaturate the colors too.  Contrast may need to be altered as well.  Big pain!

Any way to do this "Kelvin shift" in Qimage easily so I don't have to wreck the print in CS6 to make it look good under orange tungsten lights?

Maybe some "Click here for 2,000K  3,000K, 4,500K, 5,500K, 6,500K" Viewing Switch is needed in QU?  Don't know if I need to go to more blue/green in QI's color editor panel, or do a minus red/yellow instead?


Mack
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Fred A
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« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2013, 08:59:49 AM »

Quote
ell, what was a good image is now a very orange image.  Problem is with the T6 15 watt bulbs which are very orange, and get more orange with a dimmer too.  Specs say about 2,450 Kelvin and the Ott viewing light for making (viewing) them is around 5,500K and outside measures 5,200K now on my old Gossen Sixti-Color meter.  Didn't expect them to go that orange (almost like candlelight).

I assume I need to add more blue to the print, or subtract orange somehow.  Maybe even desaturate the colors too.  Contrast may need to be altered as well.  Big pain!

Any way to do this "Kelvin shift" in Qimage easily so I don't have to wreck the print in CS6 to make it look good under orange tungsten lights?

Maybe some "Click here for 2,000K  3,000K, 4,500K, 5,500K, 6,500K" Viewing Switch is needed in QU?

Hi Mac
You can go into refine and Move the White Balance slider toward the "C" for cooler, or the Editor screen and add a positive number into the Blue side , and a minus into the Red side of the White Balance, but the simple answer is go and get some proper bulbs for the viewer!!!

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Terry-M
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« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2013, 09:11:22 AM »

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but the simple answer is go and get some proper bulbs for the viewer
You may be able to get halogen versions of T6 lamps, or better still LED. A quick Google seems to indicate the latter are available. They are often sold as either "cool" or "warm versions.
Terry
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Mack
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« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2013, 07:34:36 PM »

....

You can go into refine and Move the White Balance slider toward the "C" for cooler, or the Editor screen and add a positive number into the Blue side , and a minus into the Red side of the White Balance, but the simple answer is go and get some proper bulbs for the viewer!!!


I don't see a "Refine" selection with a slider for Cool and Warm?  Must be hidden?  Huh?

I did find the White Balance (R/B %) in the Editor side though.  I used the eyedropper and selected "what looks like a grey" (There never is a grey it seems with this WB stuff) and it set some 0.2 and 2.0 in the two windows and cooled it down a bit.  Guess it is trial and error.  Ugh!

Looked for the T6 "daylight" colored tubular lamps without success.  Needs to be 30 watts per bulb max. due to the brass picture frame light and bulb sockets.  These Westinghouse T6 tubulars seem to be around 2,700 and very orange.  Gets worse with a dimmer too.

I have a small and cheap ($30) LED picture frame light by RiteLight.  It sucks!  Battery operated by 3 AA batteries, but the small LED's cast a very harsh light and very specular on the prints under it like 6 small flashlights shining on it.  Sort of an odd greenish-yellow cast to them as well which makes skin look very bad and jaundice too.

I did see the Hograth LED picture lights, but they are $1,117 eachShocked Shocked   Comes with a LED color-correction control thing for these types of issues with LED lights.  Not crazy about their refund or guarantee either, as "THERE IS NONE!"  Custom made, so no refunds for a $1,117 frame light.  Found it funny they asked, "To send them an image and they would tell me if it looked good or not under their light." - like why would they say otherwise?  Can't even see one around here or LA to look at either since they sell mostly to designers for private homes.  Better suited to paintings maybe, or scenes where one cannot call a color imbalance issue into question.

Maybe an option would be to use a slip-cover LEE heat-resistant color correction (blue) filter over the bulbs?  I have a LEE filter dealer here that might have something to cool the warm tubular tungsten's up a bit, if I cannot do it on the print.  That or dip the bulb's into some "Pebeo Sky Blue Glass Stain" maybe.

Aside, if one has a ceiling with AC wiring in it, the "Phantom Lights" might be the best idea.  Halogen daylights with a focused beam that also has an aperture to fit the size of the frame on the wall.  Probably a more even lighting over the attached frame lights too.


Mack
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Fred A
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« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2013, 08:11:32 PM »

Quote
I don't see a "Refine" selection with a slider for Cool and Warm?  Must be hidden? 

I did find the White Balance (R/B %) in the Editor side though.  I used the eyedropper and selected "what looks like a grey" (There never is a grey it seems with this WB stuff) and it set some 0.2 and 2.0 in the two windows and cooled it down a bit.  Guess it is trial and error.  Ugh!

Mack,
Here's a snap of the slider in refine.
Also, in the editor, your aim, in your case is to PUSH the image to cold.
Not to just do a White Balance. That's why you got those numbers.

Everything works right except your frame...
I looked up those lights too. As Terry said, they are all over in all temperatures..

Fred

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Mack
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« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2013, 11:16:40 PM »

Quote
I don't see a "Refine" selection with a slider for Cool and Warm?  Must be hidden? 

I did find the White Balance (R/B %) in the Editor side though.  I used the eyedropper and selected "what looks like a grey" (There never is a grey it seems with this WB stuff) and it set some 0.2 and 2.0 in the two windows and cooled it down a bit.  Guess it is trial and error.  Ugh!

Mack,
Here's a snap of the slider in refine.
Also, in the editor, your aim, in your case is to PUSH the image to cold.
Not to just do a White Balance. That's why you got those numbers.

Everything works right except your frame...
I looked up those lights too. As Terry said, they are all over in all temperatures..

Fred



Fred, where is this "Refine" thing hidden?

I cannot find how you got to that "Red circled" pane in the Help using "Refine" or "White Balance" as Search words?  I also searched on the "HDR" and nothing in the Help contents about that either?

Only White Balance I can find is in the Editor (the R/B % thing).  I don't see  WB "sliders" anywhere on the bottom?


Mack
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Fred A
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« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2013, 09:16:54 AM »

Quote
I cannot find how you got to that "Red circled" pane in the Help using "Refine" or "White Balance" as Search words?  I also searched on the "HDR" and nothing in the Help contents about that either?

Only White Balance I can find is in the Editor (the R/B % thing).  I don't see  WB "sliders" anywhere on the bottom?


Hi Mack,
I apologize. I just assumed you were doing your raw images a long while in Qimage Ultimate.

OK Right Mouse click on any raw thumb, and the last item on the menu is REFINE.
In there, you can change exposure, do White Balance with a click, add or lower Fill light, Use the HDR slider, choose from any color temp with the slider offered in the previous screen snap.

Fred
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Mack
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« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2013, 07:08:29 PM »

Quote
I cannot find how you got to that "Red circled" pane in the Help using "Refine" or "White Balance" as Search words?  I also searched on the "HDR" and nothing in the Help contents about that either?

Only White Balance I can find is in the Editor (the R/B % thing).  I don't see  WB "sliders" anywhere on the bottom?


Hi Mack,
I apologize. I just assumed you were doing your raw images a long while in Qimage Ultimate.

OK Right Mouse click on any raw thumb, and the last item on the menu is REFINE.
In there, you can change exposure, do White Balance with a click, add or lower Fill light, Use the HDR slider, choose from any color temp with the slider offered in the previous screen snap.

Fred


Thanks Fred.  I was using "TIFF files" and it doesn't appear in them.  Drove me crazy looking for it as it isn't in the "Help > Search" anyplace.  Might have to dump the TIFFs out to NEF files or something to use Refine there.

Fwiw, I did find some transparent glass tint in a sky blue color (Martha Stewart brand sold in Micheal's Art supply in USA).  Mixed it half and half with the other liquid that looks like white glue and dipped the T6 frosted lamps in them a few times.  Just need to stir and not shake as it will leave bubbles on the glass if the mixed liquid has any on the surface from shaking.  Might take a few dips, but they definitely are not orange bulbs now.  Need to set the color with heat so I will bake them by leaving them on (they do get hot for a 15 watt bulb) and see how it goes.  My color temp meter reads about 4,000 K (up from 2,500 K) now so a few more dips might do it.  No luck finding tubular T6 frosted daylight bulbs here.  A LEE #063 heat-resistant filter might work too.

Mack
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