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Author Topic: Bug or feature?  (Read 43896 times)
Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2009, 11:48:08 AM »


ED is setting his Test Strip page size FIRST - wrong sequence I think.  Huh?

Terry.

Terry and Fred,

Thank you but it isn't a solution in my shop.

Terry, I don't think a wrong sequence should exist then.

If I follow Terry's path I can do one test strip print in the time I can do 5 crops with the Thumbnail Action Crop and I only have to change paper settings in the driver once + I can drop several test crops on that print page strip. More flexible, faster. less wasted paper and still a 1:1 crop.

Fred, replace yourself in what I need on a wide format with a roll loaded. I like it that you loaded the 9800 driver but the physical printer with a roll loaded is the reason that I went that path. It takes a lot of time to set a large print page in the driver for the sequence Terry gives, unload the roll on the Z3200, load a sheet, change the driver settings for that sheet and print and then return the roll physically + driver settings again to do the total print. The minimum size of a sheet on this machine is an 21 x 35 cm approx. The minimum size of a strip off a 44" roll is 112 x 7.6 cm. That is almost equal in size. Smaller rolls, less waste.

I'm quite happy with the Thumbnail Action crop now. Maybe nothing has to be changed on the Full Page Edit crop tools with you guys around for advice but for me it will become a white area on the map again. Taking too much time, too complex and bound for failure the way I work. I was simply on the wrong track. Sorry about disturbing the peace with the bug reports.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/
















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Terry-M
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« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2009, 11:49:34 AM »

Quote
It works that way, I tried it. I even put several Original Size images in the queue,
Sorry about quoting myself but now I have a few more minutes to spare, this is what I did, and Like Fred, checked the Help to understand what to expect "out of the box".

I don’t normally make use of the Test Strip feature. I had tried it out when it was first introduced so I reminded myself about it by reading the Help, it seems straightforward.
My understanding is that the Test Strip tool produces a reduced print size (mm) but maintains the original print resolution. In that way, small areas of a large print can be printed on “scrap” paper at the correct print resolution.
To check it out with Original Size,
1) Edited an image in an external application so that it had an embedded 222 x148 mm at 400ppi.
2) Placed it in the queue with A4 paper, using original size.
3) Went to the FPE and clicked the Test Strip tool 5 times and moved the crop to a suitable area of the image.
4) The result was a print size of 73x49 mm at 400dpi. It did not make any difference whether crop was on or off.
5) Changed the paper size, to simulate printing on smaller paper or a scrap piece, everything remained at 400 ppi.
6) Added 3 additional copies of the image the queue and for each clicked the Test Strip button 5 times.
7) Changed the crop position for each copy of the image.
Cool In all cases, the print resolution remained at 400 ppi.
9) Reduced the paper size to 130x180 (5x7), the 4 images fitted on the page, as expected.

Conclusion: the test strip feature “does what it says on the DDI box”
Terry.

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Terry-M
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« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2009, 12:01:00 PM »

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Thank you but it isn't a solution in my shop.
You mean not in your Photo Shop Roll Eyes
Quote
Terry, I don't think a wrong sequence should exist then.
I don't see it as a"wrong" sequence; ok it's not mentioned precisely in the Help but you ought to know that if you first load an image into a 150x150 page, Q will ask you the usual questions and size accordingly.
Quote
If I follow Terry's path I can do one test strip print in the time
Wrong, I've already posted on how to do any number you like, and it makes no difference that I've tested on a little A4 printer rather that a big one like yours, the principals are the same!. Using Q's Test Strip feature you get a true simulation of what Qimage will do in the final print.
Quote
Sorry about disturbing the peace with the bug reports.
No worries, I've just learnt a little more about Qimage's excellent feature.  Grin
Terry.

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Fred A
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« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2009, 12:16:14 PM »

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change the driver settings for that sheet and print and then return the roll physically + driver settings again to do the total print.
Ernst, you can mitigate the situation in Qimage

If you set up a printer setup file for test strip size, then you can leave the roll
in place too.
Set the driver for user defined 8 x 10 page size. (Or similar to suit)
All settings in place for quality same as final print) SAVE it as a printer setup file.

In other words, go to RECALL and click on TEST strips 8 x 10.
Q will load the test strip printer setup file leaving the driver ready to
print on a user defined 8 x 10 page size. Then you click the Test Strip
button a few times until Q shows a print size of less than 8 x 10. "PRINT!"
You will only use 8" of paper.
Best wishes,

Fred
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rayw
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« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2009, 12:49:42 PM »

Hi,

This is how I see the requirement.

A large/expensive roll of canvas. Trying to get 'the perfect print', are the colours right, dpi, etc.

So, I want to print a two inch strip, of a selected part of an image. For example the strip may be 42inches by 2inches, and same dpi/profile etc as the final image. This needs to be orientated so that a minimum of canvas is wasted. I may want to print a number of such strips for different images, or a number of strips, at say different dpi, for the same image, the strips being printed before the final batch run. This is similar to how I did things in the darkroom.

This is what I call a 'test strip'. Is the foregoing easily achievable, hopefully by simply pressing a 'test strip' button, but if not what is the easy work around?

It my be that what you call a 'test strip' is not the same as this, but the above is what is required to be achieved.

Best wishes,

Ray
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Fred A
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« Reply #20 on: November 27, 2009, 01:11:54 PM »

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42inches by 2inches,
Best I can do is 2.64 x 1.93.
Fred  Cool
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Fred A
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« Reply #21 on: November 27, 2009, 01:46:09 PM »

Hi,

This is how I see the requirement.

A large/expensive roll of canvas. Trying to get 'the perfect print', are the colours right, dpi, etc.

So, I want to print a two inch strip, of a selected part of an image. For example the strip may be 42inches by 2inches, and same dpi/profile etc as the final image. This needs to be orientated so that a minimum of canvas is wasted. I may want to print a number of such strips for different images, or a number of strips, at say different dpi, for the same image, the strips being printed before the final batch run. This is similar to how I did things in the darkroom.

This is what I call a 'test strip'. Is the foregoing easily achievable, hopefully by simply pressing a 'test strip' button, but if not what is the easy work around?

It my be that what you call a 'test strip' is not the same as this, but the above is what is required to be achieved.

Best wishes,

Ray
Hey, Ray, I think I was able to make what you want.
Here's my steps:
Set the 9800 driver to roll paper banner mode.
Set user defined page size to 44.0 x 60.0
Place my image in the queue.
(Remembering that my test strip is to be 5.00 inches wide (in my test)
I click the Test strip icon until I have a size where one side is small enough to fit inside my test strip size.
Click Done.
As long as one side fits, then I click on RECALL. and bring in my printer setup for 5.00 x 44.0 inch page setup.
Highlight the small image on the preview page so it is selected, and click on Fit to Page for a print size.
Bingo! I have a strip with the same ppi as the original.
Try it! It works fine.
Fred
* Note The smallest dimension for the 9800 page size is 5.0 inches with roll paper.
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rayw
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« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2009, 01:54:11 PM »

Ok, then Fred, let's say a 17inch roll of canvas, and you want test strips 15inch by 2inch. The cost (in material and time) is not the same, but the method  is.

edit - this was in response to your 2.64 by 1.93. I never said it was any specific printer.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 01:57:16 PM by rayw » Logged
Fred A
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« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2009, 02:10:21 PM »

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Ok, then Fred, let's say a 17inch roll of canvas, and you want test strips 15inch by 2inch. The cost (in material and time) is not the same, but the method  is.

edit - this was in response to your 2.64 by 1.93. I never said it was any specific printer.


Still works fine. I swapped the sides in the Epson 9800 and made the roll width 3.5 (minimum allowed), and I have a perfect test strip of 3.27 x 15 inches at the same ppi.
Fred
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admin
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« Reply #24 on: November 27, 2009, 04:31:10 PM »

Ok, then Fred, let's say a 17inch roll of canvas, and you want test strips 15inch by 2inch. The cost (in material and time) is not the same, but the method  is.

edit - this was in response to your 2.64 by 1.93. I never said it was any specific printer.

Easy one.  Just set the page width to 15 inches and the page length to 2 inches in the driver.  If the driver won't allow a length that short, no problem: just use "Page Formatting", "Page Margins" and enter additional margins that create a 15 x 2 printable area so that 15 x 2 is listed above the preview page in Qimage.  Save that printer setup if you like so you can just load it in the future and get a 15 x 2 strip any time you want it.

Next just add a photo to the queue at its full size.  Let's say the full size is 15x22 and you want a 15x2 strip of that.  So just add the image at the 15x22 size, answer "Yes" that it can span more than one page, and go to the full page editor and click the test strip button one time.  Click "Done" on the full page editor to close it and that's it.  You now have a 15x2 test strip of the 15x22 original ready to print.

There are other ways to do this, but the above is the easiest: (1) set up the page size to be the size of the strip you want, (2) add the print at the original (large) size, (3) click the test strip button one time.

Here's another way to do it without using the page size:

(1) Add the image to the queue at the final size you are testing for (say 17x24).  If you are asked about spanning more than one page, answer "Yes".

(2) Go to the full page editor and click the test strip button once, click "Done", and exit the FPE.

(3) On the main window, click on the print to select it and then set the size to the test strip size you want (say 17x2).

(4) You'll see the portion of the print that is selected.  If you'd like to select a different portion to print, go back to the FPE and use the cropping tool to click/drag.

Notes: In (2), you must exit the FPE and set the new test strip size on the main window.  You can re-set the strip size as many times as you like from the main window after step (4): Qimage knows it is now a test strip and whatever size you select on the main window is assumed to be that size test strip of the original.

So now you have two ways to make a test strip any size you like.  I personally prefer the first method because you can create the size strip you want on your printer and then save that as a file like "15x2-test-strip" and you can just reload that any time you want it.

Afterthought: to me, long/skinny test "strips" are not particularly useful.  I often use sizes like 3x2 or 4x6 and then just slide them to an important part of the print.  Skinny test strips often don't give you enough perspective to judge quality.  In addition, I sometimes have 4x6 paper that is the same type as my large 13x19 that I'm printing so printing a 4x6 test strip allows me to print a test portion on 4x6 paper that is the same type of paper as my 13x19.

Mike
« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 04:43:34 PM by Mike Chaney » Logged
rayw
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« Reply #25 on: November 27, 2009, 04:42:22 PM »

Hi Fred,

I've tried it, many times. It does not work fine. I am uncertain if it works at all. It is tedious. There is a heck of a lot of clicking around, finding settings/buttons/ icons or whatever, just to achieve something basic in a print process. When cropping, (in the page editor) there seems to be a choice of shrinking the image - which is actually 'resizing' in my book - , or sort of changing the resolution. Either way, the ratio of the sides of the image stay the same as the original. It needs to be simply dragging a resizeable rectangle over the image. Maybe that is possible by setting something elsewhere, hidden away. Personally, I find much of the user interface for many relatively basic functions to be very obscure, even to the extent that an icon for a photographic crop button is a reversed 'P'.

I think it may be more straightforward to simply generate a proper test strip image in photoshop, and save it under a separate name, and then ensure I perform the same operations on it as I do for the main image.  The problem I am finding in Qimage, is that many ancillary options almost work in the way I want, but to get to the final level is often tedious, or not possible. And over the years Qimage has been developed, adding the extra functionality has obscured the ease of using the basic necessities, unless you have been with it from day one.

Thanks for your help,

Best wishes,

Ray

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rayw
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« Reply #26 on: November 27, 2009, 04:45:17 PM »

Hi Mike,

I'll try your ideas later, but that, at least the first, I understand.

Best wishes,

Ray
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Fred A
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« Reply #27 on: November 27, 2009, 04:56:28 PM »

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Easy one.  Just set the page width to 15 inches and the page length to 2 inches in the driver.  If the driver won't allow a length that short, no problem: just use "Page Formatting", "Page Margins" and enter additional margins that create a 15 x 2 printable area so that 15 x 2 is listed above the preview page in Qimage.  Save that printer setup if you like so you can just load it in the future and get a 15 x 2 strip any time you want it.

Ray, I got really close to the 2", and *he* has to trump me again. !!
 Grin Grin Grin Grin
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #28 on: November 27, 2009, 09:29:01 PM »

I have made a printing shortcut in the HP driver for a specific paper, roll width, print page size (the last with its own "test strip" name). I have made the corresponding settings for that test print strip in Qimage and saved them. When I recall the settings in Qimage the printer driver does what it should do. There has been a time it didn't but several software and firmware upgrades in the last years did wonders to the interaction of the Z models and Qimage.

I use the Thumbnail Action crop on one or more images and guesstimate the size that fits with Original Size set. Goes quite good but as written, feedback of the crop size in mm's would be nice. That should be possible with Tiffs an Jpegs. Print and take the filters off the images again when finished or shift the crop to another spot if needed for the next proof. After that enlarge the print page or do a recall on a similar job made before the proof.

I have no objection to longer strips for proof prints. It often is reproduction work and quite big. The original is here too and at the same size. Confidence grows if the strip is on the original and no nasty color or tone differences are visible along the strip. Call it a crosscut proof. Of course this can be varied in size and one selects the parts that matter.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2009, 07:58:43 AM »

Is it impossible to add the display of metric or imperial sizes of Tiffs and JPEGs in the Thumbnail Actions Filter when a crop is made ?  The size in pixels is displayed, the crop in pixels and the aspect ratio of the crop. As the original size is known of Tiffs and Jpegs most of the time it shouldn't be that difficult I guess. It would be handy in more cases than making proof crops. If there is no size recognised then a ? would be enough.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/


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