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Author Topic: Profiling for printable CDs/DVDs  (Read 24572 times)
msmart
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« Reply #15 on: February 20, 2011, 09:54:36 PM »

Quote from: Mike Chaney
Honestly, I wouldn't bother fooling with those.
Well, I've been "fooling" with them for over five years and have been extremely happy with them.

Quote from: Mike Chaney
Those print so poorly
I disagree, they produce awesome looking prints that rival any quality glossy photo paper. Have you seen them first hand or is it just an opinion? Taiyo-Yuden WaterShield white glossy DVD discs?

Quote from: Mike Chaney
I've never really understood why people try to print directly on discs anyway.
Just the opposite for me.

Quote from: Mike Chaney
The printable discs cost more than a regular disc plus a label
Yes, WaterShield discs do cost more, but I'm a videographer who shoots youth theater and sells the DVDs complete with case insert and booklet inside the case. I want a more professional look than matte labels applied to the disc. For personal use discs, I use Verbatim 95079 white printable discs.

Quote from: Mike Chaney
the labels are easier to make, faster to apply, and look a whole lot better.
I use a PhotoShop template to create the disc image - save as a jpeg file, then use Canon's CD-LabelPrint software to print the discs. Very easy and nothing to apply. I would argue that the WaterShield discs look a whole lot better than an applied label.

My trouble is that, while the print quality is excellent on the WaterShield discs, the color varies slightly from the HP Glossy Brochure Paper I use. I keep playing with the manual color settings in the Canon printer settings until I get it "close enough". In the process I waste 5 or more discs.

For argument's sake and assuming the print quality is a ton better than you think, will I be able to get a decent profile from PP given the discs physical size and shape?


Quote from: Fred A
So I ask you, how fussy are you going to be with profiling a hard printable disk,
As I mentioned, I sell the DVDs I produce to the families of the youth theater so I am very fussy. It's not very professional if the colors vary. I print the same artwork (high quality PhotoShop files - nothing downloaded) on the case insert and disc face so I want them to match as close as possible. If it were for home use as you do for your neighbors, then it wouldn't be such a big deal.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 10:14:37 PM by msmart » Logged
rayw
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« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2011, 08:11:53 AM »

I think I would find a distributor of papers who offers free or low cost profiles. Chat them up - they often have equipment for profiling that is more flexible than scanning in a square target. It depends how much you or they wish to try, and their equipment, of course.

Using profile prism, I guess you'd have to offset the target a number of times, and print on a number of discs, then after you've scanned them all in, use photoshop to piece them all together. I can see a headache, at least, coming on. However, it is possible to manually adjust the pp profiles. It may be easier to downgrade your gloss paper profile to more closely match your cd results. It may be better to sacrifice a few discs, and generate a filter to apply to either or both the paper and cd images.

hth

Best wishes,

Ray
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« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2011, 10:26:48 AM »

Well, I admit that I don't pay a lot for the printable CD's I tried: I was trying to keep costs reasonable and even then, they are much more than a label + regular CD.  I don't know what you are using to print, but for me they were incredibly inefficient too.  I do them in bulk of maybe 4+ at a time and found it much more efficient to print 4 labels and then apply those than having to babysit the printer one disc at a time.  You are aware, aren't you, that there are some very good quality glossy labels out there?  I really doubt that it's impossible to find glossy labels that compare to the printable surface of your discs.

All that aside, Ray's idea might work.  Pick a paper that prints similar and with similar driver settings.  Profile that and then use the PP tweaker to make changes to the profile until it matches by printing samples on the discs.  Might cost you a half dozen or so discs but once you're done, you'd have a working profile.

Mike

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msmart
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« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2011, 11:28:36 AM »

OK, a glimmer of hope...

I would say that the CDs you tried didn't hold a candle to the WaterShields so I can see why you have your opinion. I mentioned what I print with in my first post here, a Canon iP4500. My projects are about 25 to 40 DVDs each but babysitting the printer isn't too bad. I haven't researched labels recently but I've heard that they're "bad" as the adhesive can get warmed up in the player and cause the label to shift where the disc doesn't play well or at all anymore. I don't want to start that debate here so let's just leave it where you like labels and I don't.

I use HP Brochure Paper Q1987A that I buy from Staples. I'm happy with how it prints, folds and cuts so I don't think I'll change from it. It does print similarly (sort of) but I'm trying to get to the "next level" in hopes of making the discs match it.

I have no problem sacrificing discs to create a working profile as I'm doing that now with each project. PP tweaker? Sounds like it's where you make the fine adjustments to the profile, I like it.

So I guess the bottom line is that I have a good chance to get working profiles for the paper and discs to closely match, correct?

While I'm not a customer yet, I would echo the OPs request to create a disc shaped color target and necessary changes to PP to read it.

Ray, thanks for the suggestions. I like the idea of offsetting the target a few times.  
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 11:38:04 AM by msmart » Logged
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« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2011, 11:45:13 AM »

I have no plans to make a round target and I just don't see that being a good use of my time.  That's a significant feature to implement when you and maybe one other person will ever use it.  Let's face it, you are talking about color managing an object that, when in use, you can't even see!  You glance at it for a half second to ID the disc and then put it in the drive.  Are people really taking these things and hanging them as ornaments where they'll be displayed?  Not trying to be a smarty pants: just being realistic and I don't think making round targets is a good business decision.

Mike
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rpitas
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« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2011, 01:20:15 PM »

I've been printing TY CDs/DVDs for years and have also wished I could profile. They look very good but could be better with a profile. I'd venture to say that people look at the cd/dvds as much as the 4x6s I hand out. I however understand it's a limited market and probably not worth your effort. No complaints here. Prism and Qimage are outstanding programs!
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rayw
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« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2011, 02:33:44 PM »

If you had the time or incentive to do so, I reckon you may succeed in distorting the target image before physically printing it - (not an ideal method, but maybe print to pdf, instead of to your canon printer, then load the image into your image editor, make it circular with the hole in the middle, then print that image to your cd). You'll possibly get colour shifts and other problems in the distortion process. Once you scan in that image, distort it in reverse to get it back to the required rectangular image before running it through the rest of the pp software. Fancy writing a script or action   Shocked ?

There may be software 'out there' for doing the first transform because there was a sort of popular Victorian? gimmick using similar circular images, which only became understandable when you viewed them in the reflection of a circular mirror (glass bottle) stood in the centre of the image.

(If it were for an hp printer, I know of someone who would probably write the scripts in the blink of an eye  Wink )

Best wishes,

Ray

edited typo to pdf
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 08:09:28 PM by rayw » Logged
msmart
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« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2011, 02:48:32 PM »

Fair enough, Mike. I too want to make a good business decision on whether or not to buy your product.

I'm not asking for a guarantee but rather if you think PP will be worth my investment given what I'm trying to do.

Quote from: Mike Chaney
That's a significant feature to implement when you and maybe one other person will ever use it.
If you do polls, maybe this could be one to gauge interest.


Ray, interesting idea. Only Mike can say it that has a remote chance of working.
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« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2011, 04:03:19 PM »

There are actually a bunch of ways it could be done.  The warp/unwarp is theoretically possible.  You could also chop the target into say 12 chunks that would be about 1x1.8 inches each (4x3 chop of the target).  Then you could print four of those on each disc for a total of three discs.  Scan all three discs at once and then piece the 12 chunks together digitally to make the full target.  Just make sure you don't mix up any of the chunks.  Smiley  In fact, you could do it pretty easily with Qimage, telling it to print a 4x3 poster of the target from 1x1.87 inch pages and then printing that to file: you'd get 12 files all chunked up for you.  Then just print those 4 at a time on the discs and piece them together from the scans.

Mike
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Allmoeh
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« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2011, 02:55:18 PM »

Hello,

I'm new here, located in Germany. I'm using PP for about 2 years, now with an Epson R285, fotonic XG ink, and a Canon 8800F Scanner

The results are pretty good and I'd never like to do printing without ProfilePrism, thanks Mike for this great software.

My little business is to do recordings of live concerts, e. g. symphonic orchestras, wind bands, choirs or solo singers with piano etc. These recordings are usually delivered as Compact Discs. The regular issue there is from 30 to about 100 items per production. The covers, inlays or booklets are printing very well especially when photos are used to get a nice optical "opening." And I agree, when in use, the disks are not visible. But when you have a nice Cover and opening the bag you look to a white disk with some simple text on it or to a background picture with strange colours, this first impression is not really professional.

I'd like very much to improve this printing by having the chance to do own profiling for these printable CDs. The only lack is a suitable target and the corresponding profiling function in Prism.

So please, Mike, think about this. Surely I'm willing to pay for this extra functionality

Thanks in advance
Allmoeh
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msmart
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« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2016, 03:23:48 PM »

Continuing the conversation....

I've been a customer for a while now and tried to chunk up a DVD (again, a while back) but didn't have much success. It's most likely because I didn't have access to a good scanner.

Now that I've recently retired my Canon iP4500 and just bought a Canon MX922 and have also recently switched from JVC Watershield DVDs to FalconMedia SmartGuard Glossy DVDs, I'm back to see if anything has changed with regard to providing a target for DVDs.

With more printers having the capability to print on CD/DVDs, is there any chance you would reconsider your position of not making a round target? It's been a few years now that Canon has been able to provide direct to CD/DVD printers in the US similar to what Epson has been doing for years.

As the MX922 has a scanner and probably better software than what I had before, I'll have to give your suggestion a try: ...print a 4x3 poster of the target from 1x1.87 inch pages and then printing that to file: you'd get 12 files all chunked up for you.  Then just print those 4 at a time on the discs and piece them together from the scans.


At any rate, I'm bringing this topic to the top for consideration. Thanks.

 
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