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Author Topic: v2013.100 issues/comments  (Read 15860 times)
Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2012, 08:25:01 AM »


DFS is now the default for both image sharpening and print sharpening.


Is there a risk that jobs recalled for printing now get the new sharpening treatment and deliver prints that show detail differences to the old ones?  I understand the improvements and the new prints may look better but my customer may have another view on that. Or is there a hidden path that uses the old method when a job is recalled?

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Fred A
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« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2012, 08:49:06 AM »

Quote
s there a risk that jobs recalled for printing now get the new sharpening treatment and deliver prints that show detail differences to the old ones?  I understand the improvements and the new prints may look better but my customer may have another view on that. Or is there a hidden path that uses the old method when a job is recalled?

Hi Ernst,
Been a while since you have been around. Hope all is well.

Mike has covered that contingency by having Qimage Ultimate revert to the old style by clicking next to DFS and selecting USM, and also clicking on the Blue Ball next to Smart Sharpen in Job Properties and select Smart Sharpen USM instead of Smart Sharpen DFS.

That should cover it...

I am not sure about old saved jobs retaining the old default, but I tried new Jobs saves with USM, and they RECALL from JOBS saved with USM as a default.

Fred
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Terry-M
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« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2012, 08:52:25 AM »

Hi Ernrst,
Quote
Or is there a hidden path that uses the old method when a job is recalled?
Further to Fred's post -

The blue dot will turn red to show that the smart sharpen is different from the editor setting. See screen shot attached below.
If you re-save the Job the USM smart sharpen will be saved too, I just tested it.
If the editor was used to sharpen the image, then that will need changing back to USM too but that is not saved as part of the Job.

Terry
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Fred A
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« Reply #18 on: October 18, 2012, 11:33:01 AM »

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If you re-save the Job the USM smart sharpen will be saved too, I just tested it.
If the editor was used to sharpen the image, then that will need changing back to USM too but that is not saved as part of the Job.

An easy and quick way to do this is to right click the thumbnail (or a group of thumbnails) select CUSTOM FILTER, and click teh change to USM and DONE.

You don't have to go into the Editor itself.

Fred
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MelW
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« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2012, 03:39:02 PM »

I notice that the raw processing option now also uses DFS rather than USM.  I am trying to figure out how all of this plays together with any settings or sharpening I do in the full editor.  If I do additional sharpening in the full editor, does QU actually perform two separate sharpening steps?  Or does it look at the sharpening already applied in raw developing and then just increase it appropriately?  I assume that previously processed raw images will remain with USM raw processing unless I specifically refresh.  Yes? Will be doing lots of experimenting this week. Good stuff.
Mel W.  Columbia Md.
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Terry-M
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« Reply #20 on: October 18, 2012, 04:51:15 PM »

Hi Mel,
I'm pretty sure the editor does additional sharpening.
A raw image is basically soft so any raw processing program will do some basic sharpening and that is what QU raw preferences are for.
Using the editor is for more creative sharpening or to help with problem images.Raw sharpening cannot possibly be a solution for every image; it may be sufficient for some but many will need that additional boost depending on the subject, lighting conditions, lens used, etc. etc.
Mike has said a little about this on the web site DFS section: http://www.ddisoftware.com/qimage-u/tech-dfs.htm
Terry
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Fred A
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« Reply #21 on: October 18, 2012, 04:58:32 PM »

Quote
I notice that the raw processing option now also uses DFS rather than USM.  I am trying to figure out how all of this plays together with any settings or sharpening I do in the full editor.  If I do additional sharpening in the full editor, does QU actually perform two separate sharpening steps?  Or does it look at the sharpening already applied in raw developing and then just increase it appropriately?  I assume that previously processed raw images will remain with USM raw processing unless I specifically refresh.  Yes? Will be doing lots of experimenting this week. Good stuff.
Mel W.  Columbia Md.

Comments on above:
Hi Mel,
The default when you open an image or add an image to the queue will be DFS.  If it's an image that you printed before, and you want to repeat the exact same characteristics, you need only reset DFS to USM with one click.  (See screen snaps) Then change teh Smart Sharpen to USM.... see snap.
After you change the DFS to USM it will save the new settings and will remember them.
Next time you open that image it *will* open in USM.
The sharpening offered in the RAW options is applied to all images from *that* camera. It is a base setting and is to be set by the user so his naturally soft Raw images look decent to start with.
Yes, the DFS sharpening is added to the image in the editor, but it is not added like a teaspoon of salt to a recipe. You see on screen what the image looks like and add DFS until you are happy.

Have you played the video?

In response to your implied question:  Will my old saved images that were saved with USM open in USM?
No. You can quickly change to USM, but look at the image first. If the amount of radius and strength were reasonable, then you wont see much difference if any with DFS. If the numbers were higher, then you will see a pretty obvious improvement.
If you still want to use USM; ONE CLICK.

Hope this helps
Fred
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MelW
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« Reply #22 on: October 18, 2012, 05:43:19 PM »

Fred -

Thanks.  This was actually more of a "what's going on under the hood" question as I pretty much understand how to use.  I was just wondering - if I set the raw processing and the editor are set so that both use the same sharpening - (whether USM or DFS) - whether there are two different sharpening steps applied, and whether I would be better off to do all of the sharpening in only one place (for example - when you mouse over the white balance dropper in  the editor, it tells you that it is better to do this in the refine raw window).  Come to think of it, wouldn't it be better to have sharpening available in the refine raw window?

MelW
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Fred A
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« Reply #23 on: October 18, 2012, 06:18:55 PM »

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Come to think of it, wouldn't it be better to have sharpening available in the refine raw window?

Not really, Mel.
Remember there are different needs involved here.
In The RAW refine, you are sharpening *all* the images the same, giving a basic sharpening to all.
In the Editor, each image might need different sharpening, depending on the lens, the F stop, the type of scene, contrast, etc. Some shots do not need extra sharpening if the light is just right.
So you become the Maestro in the Editor as you  squeeze out the best picture...
Fred
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MelW
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« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2012, 07:19:52 PM »

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In The RAW refine, you are sharpening *all* the images the same, giving a basic sharpening to all


Huh?  Wait a minute.  When I am in the editor and I click on the little green box and go to the raw editor, I thought I am only adjusting the current picture.  You say those changes affect all the pictures in the folder?  Sorry for being confused or confusing anyone else.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2012, 07:21:37 PM by MelW » Logged
Terry-M
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« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2012, 07:30:57 PM »

I an made an error when printing just now  Roll Eyes
I had set USM in smart sharpening this morning when checking something for another post reply - forgot to change it back!
I now have 2 8"x10.5" (202mm x 269mm) prints - print ppi = 441. Both with DFS image sharpening but print with USM and the other DFS.
See image attached below.
There are some small fringes on the USM version on the left hand side of the head and where the grass stalks overlap his body. On a larger print they would be much more obvious.
The DFS version has none, of course!
I thought others may find this information useful and I conclude an older saved print job, although not identical, would be better printed with DFS.
Terry
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Terry-M
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« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2012, 07:47:13 PM »

Mel,
Fred seems to be having a nap  Roll Eyes he's not logged in.
Quote
Huh?  Wait a minute.  When I am in the editor and I click on the little green box and go to the raw editor, I thought I am only adjusting the current picture
The raw preferences sharpening setting is applied to globally all images, except if different settings for a particular camera are saved separately. Then it is global per camera.
The editor sharpening only applies to that image open in the editor.
When you click the green button to open Refine you are refining that single image again.
The raw sharpening is, as I said, is global so no change will be made to that when the refine screen is opened from the editor.

Under the hood, you probably know this:
Raw preference settings are saved in Application data\profiles as a .qrs file.
Editor settings (= filter) for an image are saves in the image folder as a .flt file.

I hope that is clear now.  Wink
Terry
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MelW
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« Reply #27 on: October 18, 2012, 08:11:37 PM »

Terry -

Yep - got it  - that is how I thought it was.  Thanks for clarifying

Mel
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Fred A
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« Reply #28 on: October 18, 2012, 08:25:21 PM »


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Fred seems to be having a nap   he's not logged in.

Not true!
What actually happened was my dog, Tammy, (80 lbs.) was napping across our big queen size bed.
I didn't want her to fall off so I snuggled up next to her and held her to be sure.

Next thing I remember is Marilyn called her to eat.
Wham! Slam! she leaped  off the bed leaving me with a bed cover full of DFS   (Dog Fur Sheets)

She stepped on me when jumping off the bed. I said, "Hey! USM?    U see me?

She looked at me with a look that only a sweet dog can have.... she seemed to have the HALO of an angel!
« Last Edit: October 19, 2012, 04:14:13 PM by Fred A » Logged
davidh
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« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2012, 02:54:59 AM »

 Mike,
Any plans on adding TTDFS to the new sharpening tool ?
I often prefer to do selective sharpening.

David
« Last Edit: October 20, 2012, 03:13:17 AM by davidh » Logged
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