Gicleemedia
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« on: November 04, 2009, 12:48:07 AM » |
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Mike,
In all the years of QIMAGE and all the millions of Canvas prints it must have made for people around the world I still have'nt seen the option to make the borders mirrored images of the image ends for stretched canvas usage.
Since canvas needs the mirror edge and then more white border for stretching we need much more than just two colors.
You cannot automate this in PS as the stretcher bars are a fixed size yet the images vary. Its very time consuming by hand in PS.
Mike??? Has'nt this been requested before???
Bruce
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rayw
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« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2009, 09:31:04 PM » |
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Hi Bruce, Most of the canvases I've seen - not that many in total - the image is cropped big enough to cover the edges of the frame. This leads to problems if you have carefully framed the subject in camera, etc., and I think some pattern extension (mirroring) would be useful. As you imply, it needs to be done at the printing stage. I would imagine it would be a fair bit of effort to include it in Qimage, since afaik, it does not use the concept of layers. I think it would be a very worthwhile addition, however. On a slightly different note, what is your impression of http://www.hahnemuehle.com/site/en/216/gallerie-wraps.html ? It sort of looks cheap to me, the finished item. I do not like the idea of slitting the corners - I reckon it would lead to tearing, etc., nor the idea of glue on the edges. Best wishes, Ray |
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2009, 10:10:59 PM » |
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Mike,
In all the years of QIMAGE and all the millions of Canvas prints it must have made for people around the world I still have'nt seen the option to make the borders mirrored images of the image ends for stretched canvas usage.
Has'nt this been requested before???
Bruce
It has been requested by me some years ago. Mike didn't think it should be part of Qimage. So I wrote several Photoshop actions to do the different job. met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html |
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Gicleemedia
Newbie
Posts: 4
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« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2009, 10:49:58 PM » |
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All, It is vital to future of QIMAGE that this function becomes part of its base, it is a print time option and cannot be automated by PS actions as the bar size is fixed and the image changes to the mm. As for the "lick and stick" quickie canvas systems no fine art printer would use them. They have many issues including the lack of a warp at the back making a sharp white edge that is'nt always straight, a too sharp fold that cracks non laminated canvas and a tendancy to open the corners as the rear pins slide out. The people who use these probably have smaller 13 inch printers and there you can only print small images as you loose too much image "around the corner". You also cannot use them for paper prints. Ray, I considered all this years ago and we sell a better way of doing this for photo stores. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJF0A0V4eg0 |
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2009, 08:46:10 AM » |
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All,
It is vital to future of QIMAGE that this function becomes part of its base, it is a print time option and cannot be automated by PS actions as the bar size is fixed and the image changes to the mm.
Whether it is vital for Qimage is something Mike has to decide but it is absent in many RIPs as well. Original image sizes will dictate the aspect ratio of the stretcher bar aspect ratio with any choice of canvas wrap method. A complex relation exists for the Gallery Wrap as it has to be made of straight image content only and the stretcher bar depth plays a role there too. A 1:1 relation exists for the Mirror wraps etc. If you want to use standard stretcher bar sizes then sometimes a compromise will be needed: a deformation of the image aspect ratio or a crop. The aspect ratio change is not yet possible in Qimage. Then there is the usual canvas shrinkage in the roll length that has to be compensated. I have to say that Photoshop can handle all that and it can be automated with the actions too. met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html |
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rayw
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« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2009, 05:29:48 PM » |
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So, how does this work at the moment? Suppose aspect ratio of 3x2, say. I have a canvas roll, 2ft wide. I want a maximum size print, so allowing, say, 2 inches all round for the frame edges/back, the actual image to print will be 20 inches by 30inches. But my image on file is 2336 by 3504 pixels. That is 116.8 pixels per inch, so in photoshop I have to make a mirror strip of 233.6 pixels  So, I make it, say, 234 pixels, all around the edge of the image (assuming I can eventually print right to the edge of the canvas). I then load the whole thing back into Qimage, and print it as 24inches by 34inches, is that right? It would be easier, to add a wide border in photoshop, and be able to add it to the image in Qimage, sizing the main image to 20inches by 30inches - it would save some awkward sums that way. I'm not sure if this could be saved as a tif boarder for qimage, but either way is very messy, I reckon. Need to do some thinking on this..... Best wishes, Ray |
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admin
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« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2009, 11:45:56 PM » |
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I'll certainly consider it. I don't remember anyone ever asking for mirrored edges: only umpteen border colors.
Mike
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rayw
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« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2009, 02:24:13 AM » |
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Hi Mike, Great. I'm not sure if a mirror wrap looks better than an extrusion wrap. I think the extrusion wrap may be easier to produce. Personally I'd not be concerned about what happens at the back of the frame, the image edge pixels could be more or less extruded/repeated to the edge of the canvas, or to a defined border. For the mirror version you'd have to dig further back into the actual image for increased frame depth. (I'm assuming you'd be generating the extrusion/mirror border in Qimage) Better put on the coffee  Best wishes, Ray |
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« Last Edit: November 11, 2009, 02:26:16 AM by rayw »
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2009, 08:42:33 AM » |
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I'll certainly consider it. I don't remember anyone ever asking for mirrored edges: only umpteen border colors.
Mike
Mike, Former Qimage listL: >> Mon Aug 14, 2006 5:58 pm Feature request I'm looking for a method that would extend the image with a border around it that has some relation to the image itself. It would be a convenient way to print canvas and get the edges in harmony with the image at the front after the canvas is nailed on the frame. What I was thinking off is stretching the contour pixels say an inch beyond the image size chosen. A bit blurred would be nice too. Another method would be to mirror the image at four sides and crop at one inch but I think the first method would look better. Could that be an additional border choice of Qimage ? I'm sure this can be done one way or another with image editors but it suits a professional print program too in my opinion. Ernst -- -- Ernst Dinkla www.pigment-print.com( unvollendet ) << I know you normally give a low rating to my requests. I think it is not because they are so obscure that nobody would need them, but just a personal thing. Which is something I have learned to live with. met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html |
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admin
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« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2009, 09:14:32 PM » |
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I know you normally give a low rating to my requests. I think it is not because they are so obscure that nobody would need them, but just a personal thing. Which is something I have learned to live with.
Honestly, I didn't know what you meant by "mirror the image at four sides and crop at one inch"... the recent explanation was a lot better. And I didn't focus on it because you said you preferred the other method over the mirroring. Mike |
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ballentphoto
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« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2009, 02:10:04 AM » |
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Count me in on wishing for this For my canvas prints I wrote my own action that goes into the image and mirrors 1.6" of the image outward, then it adds guides for the fold marks and the centerline... unfortunately I have not figure out how to turn the guides into printable lines that would knock a few minutes out of my process. Any one know how to do this and you get a copy of the action  |
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2009, 11:14:57 AM » |
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I know you normally give a low rating to my requests. I think it is not because they are so obscure that nobody would need them, but just a personal thing. Which is something I have learned to live with.
Honestly, I didn't know what you meant by "mirror the image at four sides and crop at one inch"... the recent explanation was a lot better. And I didn't focus on it because you said you preferred the other method over the mirroring. Mike Mike, The thread after that feature request didn't leave much room for confusion though. I could add the messages here but for me it is a passed station. I followed up an advice in that thread to make PS actions instead of asking for that feature in Qimage. They were not as easy to make as the advice suggested or maybe I wanted to make it easier for the user and added too many features at the same time. They work fine however. met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html |
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admin
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« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2009, 02:03:52 PM » |
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The thread after that feature request didn't leave much room for confusion though. I could add the messages here but for me it is a passed station.
I followed up an advice in that thread to make PS actions instead of asking for that feature in Qimage. They were not as easy to make as the advice suggested or maybe I wanted to make it easier for the user and added too many features at the same time. They work fine however.
If the thread morphed into PhotoShop actions, it likely went in my ignore basket from that point forward. No matter. I'll look into adding it now that the explanation/goal is clear. Mike |
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Seth
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« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2009, 02:51:47 PM » |
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Ernst-
Using some distort/stretch on the edges has its benefits. It's is really too hard for people to tell it has been done on the edges. It also does not require a "hard" edge where you MUST have the stretcher bar. The last advantage is not having to "dig" so deeply into the image to create enough border.
I am not talking anything extreme, but using 18mm and "stretching it" to 25mm is no big deal IMO.
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Seth
<CWO4 (FMF) USN, Ret.>
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Ernst Dinkla
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« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2009, 03:45:02 PM » |
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Ernst-
Using some distort/stretch on the edges has its benefits. It's is really too hard for people to tell it has been done on the edges. It also does not require a "hard" edge where you MUST have the stretcher bar. The last advantage is not having to "dig" so deeply into the image to create enough border.
I am not talking anything extreme, but using 18mm and "stretching it" to 25mm is no big deal IMO.
The actions I wrote go up to 2" stretcher bar depth and near 20 feet lengths. With a choice of mirrored, extruded, deflected, colored, patterned + blurs or another filter if that is your choice. Including lines printed to control the centering and tension from the back of the frame. The deflection method is popular, it is more or less what you describe. met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html |
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